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Azaz'el
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PostSubject: Movie - Legion   Sun Mar 07, 2010 10:19 pm

Has anyone been to see the movie Legion yet?

It's just been released here in the Uk and I'm hoping to see it in the next few weeks. I don't ecpect anything fantastic, but was wondering what the portrayal of angels was like, especially the likes of Micha'el and Gabri'el?

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PostSubject: Re: Movie - Legion   Thu Mar 18, 2010 5:00 am

*smile* I'll wait until you see it. ...I wouldn't want to ruin the surprise. Very Happy

Once you do see it, then we'll talk.

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PostSubject: Re: Movie - Legion   Fri Mar 19, 2010 2:36 pm

I personaly liked it but did not like the portrayals all that well even my mentor said like it but don'tr really go by it. Though I did like how Michael protects humans instead of what Gabriel was doing. Thats all I will say.
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PostSubject: Re: Movie - Legion   Fri Mar 19, 2010 7:12 pm

I'm waiting for someone to explain the point of the plot to me. I mean, I get that in the movie Michael's mission was to protect humanity from God's wrath because He had given up on us, and that the other angels were mindlessly following orders, which was not the right thing to do. That part was sort of okay, if highly unlikely. But little else made sense to me. Why that girl, that baby, and in that way? It just left me with a bad feeling, and I really didn't care if the kid was saved or not in the end. It was like there was a whole piece of the story missing, one I'm expected to know but don't. Somewhat entertaining because of the action, but overall not what I was hoping for... The best part was the fight scene between Michael and Gabriel. Other than that, it was like... who cares?

Az, I'm a little worried about your reaction to it (especially the fight scene I mentioned above), given everything that's been said. I have a feeling you're going to find it disturbing on a personal level, so be prepared.

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PostSubject: Re: Movie - Legion   Tue Mar 23, 2010 11:05 pm

OK, I have now seen it ................... hmmmmm!

Az

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PostSubject: Re: Movie - Legion   Wed Mar 24, 2010 6:43 am

LOL... is that a good hmmm, a bad hmmm... or a WTF hmmm? (Personally, mine was the latter!)

It takes a while to process, doesn't it? Smile I am so dying to hear your thoughts.


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PostSubject: Re: Movie - Legion   Wed Mar 24, 2010 10:11 pm

I think it was a mix of all 3 hmmm's.... some parts annoyed me, some entertained me, some I liked. Personally, I didn't agree with the way they portrayed both Gabri'el and Micha'el, there certainly weren't like that in my memories. I think this has been said before, but you could almost switch the names of the characters and the way they were portrayed and come a little closer to how they were.

Some of the story didn't seem to be explained and therefor make much sense, and the ending was.... open.

Ultimately, it managed to show that Angels are not the most pleasant of beings and not the sort you'd invite around for ta with your Mother. But perhaps it showed them more as mindless creatures just following orders rather than those who had important dutuies to perform.

Az

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PostSubject: Re: Movie - Legion   Thu Mar 25, 2010 5:59 am

Az, you have a way of "hitting the nail on the head", which I really like. The lack of explanations was my first complaint, but maybe the director was hoping for a sequel to explain some of it? I was wondering if it was based off a book or comic series I had no knowledge of, and perhaps that was why I didn't understand it. But okay... let's roll with it.

Then there was the "mindlessness" of the angels that disturbed me. I think that's what gave me the strongest reaction, and I remember driving home in the car and trying to explain to my teenage daughter how stupid it was to think the angels would ever be acting on their own, outside God's authority - especially those two (Michael and Gabriel). Of course that was before I found this place, and now... I understand that this is entirely possible, although I haven't totally been disillusioned!

Another thing that disturbed me was how the angels in the movie possessed humans to kill/torture them. That was reticent of demons and my understanding of them. But from what I understand/know, all demons are fallen angels but not all fallen angels are demons... so that could be plausible. Not probable, but plausible. So I reconciled myself by thinking that maybe the angels in the movie, the nameless ones, were actually supposed to be fallen angels/demons, but certainly not the good kind. Smile But if they were... then why in the #@$! would they be acting under the authority of an Archangel, i.e. Gabriel? Made no sense to me, and left me with a bad taste in my mouth. Any thoughts on this?

I find it interesting that you think the the roles should be reversed. People have been trained to think of Michael as the number one guy, the angel closest to God because he carries out God's justice and protects us. This may be because his name invokes images of the defeat of Satan. He is very closely linked with the defeat of evil, thus our champion.

I'm curious to know what others know of demons and how they came to be, and this image of good angels and bad angels. How far have some of the fallen gone?
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PostSubject: Re: Movie - Legion   Thu Mar 25, 2010 11:07 pm

I don't want to single handedly post in this thread so I'm hoping others will come jump in soon......

The Shadow do not posess humans as they did in the movie. We tend to be born into the body we will inhabit, just as with the souls of humans, and then we awaken at some point, some earlier than others. As for doing things against the will of the Source.... just remember that the Shadow were the ones whose task it was to interpret the commands of the Source. But as with all beings, you soon realise that the interpretation can be wrong or made to fit the beliefs of the individual or even choir that hold the power. So, having had the origninal position of authority I had, I believed that their interpretation was wrong... and that led to the results that we know so well.

Micha'el being the champion is in many ways similar to the idea of Conan the Barbarian being the first High Lord of all Humanity. Micha'el had the supposed dashing good looks, the might and muscle and was an excellent warrior. But he didn't have the skill, knowledge or ability to rule. He was the poster boy of the Warriors, nothing more. Maybe that is something that helped tip him over the edge.
To my mind there were none of the Fallen in the movie, other than Micha'el, who went against the rules and allowed the child to live. And as such,e lost his wings... in other words, he lost his ability to return home, to travel beyond the realms of this world.

You ask how far have some of the Fallen have gone. Perhaps the better question is how far have some of the Shadow gone. To my mind, butchering and slaughtering your own brothers, then exiling their souls beyond time is a pretty horrendous thing to do, just because they dared to love another Race.

By the way, I'm pleased you don't mind my way of hitting the nail on the head... most people tend to think I'm just a little too blunt!!! But I'm far too old to change the habit of a lifetime now. Smile

Az

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PostSubject: Re: Movie - Legion   Thu Mar 25, 2010 11:55 pm

My vote of the movie Legion was....Ehhhhhhhuuuuuuu!

In order to know and feel the true nature of the fallen one's one, is forced to say of those things that are sad but so ultimately truly said "That you just had to be there, one is truly forced into order to fully grasp and understand all the ins and outs of an all out dirty ass fight! Maybe just maybe "Familiarity breeds contempt but "Oh what the hell!" I Still may love him but never did like anything that he said or did, either in context or out of context or even by any thought word or deed!

I still walk softly and still carry a big stick, even though I disguise it as a walking stick!

Ouza cyclops
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PostSubject: Re: Movie - Legion   Fri Mar 26, 2010 5:31 am

Quote :
You ask how far have some of the Fallen have gone. Perhaps the better question is how far have some of the Shadow gone. To my mind, butchering and slaughtering your own brothers, then exiling their souls beyond time is a pretty horrendous thing to do, just because they dared to love another Race.

But what of the first Fall, the one that happened before the Watchers when a third of all angels rebelled? That Fall was not out of a love for Humanity, it was out of jealousy and hate. These are the other Fallen I am speaking of... those who have not been reborn and who continue to hold hate and malice in their hearts and then act on it. There is such a thing as Evil, I am convinced of it. I read here that someone (Seraphyna maybe?) said there are those who go too far... those who should be destroyed because they bring it on themselves. These are the ones I considered to be demons, who have walked too far down the path of no return. Whether they possess people or not, I don't know. But they certainly can make a person's life miserable!

As for how far the Shadow have gone, in any argument or disagreement there are always two sides opposing each other, and each usually believes passionately that they are "right". Barbaric as it was, and please... I mean no disrespect here... but could it be possible that you did go too far in some respects? Sometimes we can do the wrong thing for the right reasons, and it stills turns out to be wrong. I certainly don't mean to make light of your experiences/memories or what happened to you, and I don't wish to debate the "rightness" or "wrongness" of the end result and what they did to you, but even from your own account, especially early on, I get the feeling of out-of-control emotions dictating many of the events. Zealous love/idealism is one of the most dangerous forces on this planet. Many, many humans have gone to extremes in the name of love, but does that make it right?

Just a thought. Wink

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PostSubject: Re: Movie - Legion   Sat Mar 27, 2010 10:20 pm

To be honest I think we all went too far. As much as I have strong feelings regarding those who murdered me and my brothers, my hands are not free from blood. But, I still have to say that the resulting civil war wasn't started by the Fallen ..... we refused to sit down and die without a fight, but we didn't begin the final acts that were comitted.

Emotions tend to become heightened and spill over into action whenever there is a threat to safety or the perception of normality. We are all the blame for what happened, so some extent..... which is why we are offering the hand of friendship back to the Shadow so that we can unite before it is too late. The problem is that they are refusing to even meet with us and consider our reconciliation.

Az

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PostSubject: Re: Movie - Legion   Mon Mar 29, 2010 6:00 am

I was worried that what I had said might be taken personally and I was glad to see your response, which indicated to me that you heard what I was trying to say. From what I'm piecing together from your accounts and by my own research, your Fall was perpetuated by a chain of events that gained momentum and slid out of control. I can see faults on both sides, ending with the vicious act of the doomed civil war, yours and your brothers' judgement, and the sentence that followed. However, I guess what I was questioning was how much responsibility have you taken for the events prior to the civil war? From the beginning it is clear that your rebellious tendencies resulted in leading others astray, but they ultimately made their own decisions. Relationships were formed, bonds were formed... right or wrong it happened as a result of going after that "forbidden fruit"... a sort of thumbing your nose at the establishment. But were the rules in place for a reason? I doubt anyone can answer this now, but it still doesn't hurt to ask.

On the Shadow side, they ascended Enoch with positive results. The Source changed slightly, but not drastically, and if Enoch became Metatron then wasn't it a successful experiment? However, Shemyaza - angry at the establishment and following his own rebellious nature, spurred on by his love for Ish and wanting to be with her forever - ascended a human prematurely without thought to anyone but himself, and that ruined it for every Shadow. Of course they were angry! They're probably still pissed off at you guys for what you did and the far reaching consequences it had on their lives and the Universe itself. So the challenge is how to make amends... how to get beyond what happened and achieve unification. The actions of the Grigori started this, so unfortunately it's probably up to the Grigori to fix it. But I suspect you know that already.

They were wronged, and in turn you were wronged. But two wrongs do not make a right, especially in this case. Have you tried looking at it from the other perspective? Forgive me for my bluntness, but you seem to be stuck on the end rather than trying to see the whole picture.
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PostSubject: Re: Movie - Legion   Mon Mar 29, 2010 2:20 pm

No need to apologize... you're absolutely right! Except for the fact that Shemyaza was not banished but sent elsewhere and returned on his own eventually for the purpose to rectify and serve a final repentance and the atonement for his deeds!

You know geneticists where in high demand at that time. For as long as he could hold the memory of the the event in his mind and before the constant reincarnations set in to obliterate all memory of those both sad yet beautiful days, he did try and still is trying to atone by continuing to love, help and give hope with respect to anyone who is willing to accept it, ever since the so called beginning with and prior to the Atlantean period!

But chose as punishment and as a reminder to stay and defend and will continue to stay well after the 144208 have departed successfully so that they all may progress spiritually on to that next level of attainability of spiritual awareness!

So to say the least, he could have stayed gone but did work his way back not out of spite but in order to search for the originals who had come with him prior to this so called bad man flood brought on by the gods at the time. That's why Az is unhappy every time, I bring up the words alien, ufo, multidimensional or even multi-verse his is a different viewpoint and I'm not about to shoot the man down for what he wholeheartedly believes to be true!

Did we have wings??? No Were we Gods or angels ???? No. This was just a team set up from some where else and put together in order to develop an empty minded army of automatons for those so called others who could not fight their own worthless and selfish and maniacal wars!

I'm neither an angel nor demon, I'm just not even from here at all, although my body houses the spirit, of Shemyaza which now has made me purposefully and still makes me totally involved in the safety and well being to all of Gaia and her people of which I have have always loved and admired so much and have fought war after war after war for and will continue to do so!

You know it's really anti-climatic to finally have the ability to reach out to those you love and have loved and to be rebuked for doing so and having to go through the process of having to prove one's self worth all over again! Now that's hell! Do I still love Az and Wishglow and all the others, yes of course... will I die a million deaths to see them free once more, yes most definitely! But I will not be able to be with them when they leave the promise was that they go and I stay in their stead until Gaia is no more!

Ouza

p.s. Reincarnation can be and still, is a bitch to break away from!
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PostSubject: Re: Movie - Legion   Mon Mar 29, 2010 10:37 pm

Ouza wrote:
So to say the least, he could have stayed gone but did work his way back not out of spite but in order to search for the originals who had come with him prior to this so called bad man flood brought on by the gods at the time. That's why Az is unhappy every time, I bring up the words alien, ufo, multidimensional or even multi-verse his is a different viewpoint and I'm not about to shoot the man down for what he wholeheartedly believes to be true!!

I'm pleased you're not goinbg to shoot me down, I am far too tired to keep dodging bullets!!! LOL

We all have different names, viewpoints and understanding gained in this life. Just as we all have different beliefs in what the past means.

Ouza wrote:
Did we have wings??? No Were we Gods or angels ???? No. This was just a team set up from some where else and put together in order to develop an empty minded army of automatons for those so called others who could not fight their own worthless and selfish and maniacal wars

THere are some who believe they had wings, there are some who feel these wings were often an expression of their spiritual journeys. Again, we all see these things in different ways, be they physical wings, spiritual tools or metal craft.

Ouza wrote:
You know it's really anti-climatic to finally have the ability to reach out to those you love and have loved and to be rebuked for doing so and having to go through the process of having to prove one's self worth all over again! Now that's hell! Do I still love Az and Wishglow and all the others, yes of course... will I die a million deaths to see them free once more, yes most definitely! But I will not be able to be with them when they leave the promise was that they go and I stay in their stead until Gaia is no more!

It is a very difficult and painful expreience to turn to those you feel should be open and accepting and have them questioning and doubtful. But I think we've all been here and been upset by the 'humanity' in those that we thought were more. But maybe we all, at times, need to accept that we are physically Human and so have Human characteristics.

Can you tell me more about the promise that you mention here?

Az

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PostSubject: Re: Movie - Legion   Tue Mar 30, 2010 7:34 am

save your money and wait until you have a chance to watch it for super cheap, it wasnt worth a damn cent.
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PostSubject: Re: Movie - Legion   Tue Mar 30, 2010 3:08 pm

Every time, I start to type something in reply to you on this computer it won't allow me to continue on!

Except for now....Damn it !!!


I will try later!
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PostSubject: Re: Movie - Legion   Tue Mar 30, 2010 6:09 pm

I really shouldn't respond to this thread as I am far too emotional... isn't that always the case with me guys... shoot from the gut.

That's not to say that anything anyone has said offended me. Some of it was hard to hear but that's my issue.

Sorry though but I can't accept that anything the Fallen did justified what was done to them. And yes Shem was (and still is Wink ) headstrong he didn't do what he did because he was pissed on a personal level... well maybe a little for being thrown off a cliff, but still...

And as for Gabri'el and Micha'el... well I won't go into that either. Anyone who knows me knows my feelings on those two... although Gabri'el is redeemable in my view whereas Micha'el is not, cannot and never will be. There is nothing that he could ever do, say or endure that would move me to forgive him for what he did. The things I saw in those end days drove me mad and the recalling of them, even though only in tiny bits and peices has come damn close to doing so again.

I know that it was no Micha'el who ordered what was done. He was no in control. There were others who acted on orders too... but if you had only seen his eyes.... he didn't just act, he enjoyed.
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PostSubject: Re: Movie - Legion   Tue Mar 30, 2010 11:06 pm

There was a touch of madness in Micha'els eyes from the very first time he opened them and looked at his brothers for the first time. Although in truth it would be far too easy to blame it on madness when in truth he wasn't ....... which makes it more dreadful and a shameful thing that no one acted to improve upon his condition.

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PostSubject: Re: Movie - Legion   Wed Mar 31, 2010 3:20 am

I'm glad you responded, Ish. Thanks for that, and I do hope I didn't offend you. That certainly wasn't my intention! I'm still trying to figure things out in my own way.

Basically, taking away the emotions of the end, what I'm asking is who should take responsibility for what happened? I see fault on all sides... one decision leading to another decision... and pretty soon everything went to "hell and a hand basket". (Not exactly sure what that saying means, but it seems apt!) Unfortunately too many wars have begun with several small events that sparked more and more, so that soon people forget what started it, and all they remember is the bloodshed. I think it's important to step back and try and see/remember how all of the events culminated into that one final event, taking perspectives from both sides, in order to get an accurate picture of what really happened. We each have our own unique perspectives based on our beliefs and experiences. This is why two eye witness can come away from the scene of an accident with totally different accounts of what happened. By meshing together the two, that's when we get to a clearer picture of what some may call "the truth"... what really happened.

Az, was that the first time you had ever seen Micha'el... at the trial/judgement? And if they weren't in control, then who was?

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PostSubject: Re: Movie - Legion   Wed Mar 31, 2010 10:44 pm

I was there when Micha'el was created. They had such high hopes for him and the others, they gave them positions of power an dtrained them to such a high standard... yet in the end, the true nature of the individuals soul soon emerges.

As for who as in control, there was a small group who were pulling the strings. The unfortunate situation is that those who wielded the real power had little interest in what they thought was a diagreement in the lower ranks, so let others deal with the physical worlds whilst they remained with their faces turned to the Source. So, greedy for power, some of them were guided by one specific individual who shall, at this time, remain nameless. He pulled the strings, and he gave the orders that the others such as Micha'el obeyed. A few did question, such as Raph, but even they bowed their heads and did as they were told.

I understand what you are saying regarding the need to step back, view the events objectively and then accept partial blame. I have done that, I have paid for my arrogance and have apologised. I have offered my life and soul to repair the damage that I began. I have put out the call to all Shadow so that we can begin talks, see our faults and our strengths and unite again. And as I have said, there has been nothing from the remaining ranks of Shadow to me or any of the Fallen.... other than attempts to prevent awakening and to hide the past from us.

I still wait, I still remember and search and offer my apologies to any and all who will listen. But I can only accept my portion of blame. I have been the scapegoat long enough, there is nothing more I can do without the others meeting me half way.

Az

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PostSubject: Re: Movie - Legion   Thu Apr 01, 2010 6:14 am

Yes, unfortunately forgiveness is a two way street. If the other party isn't ready to accept one's apology there isn't much that can be done. We only have control of one person in this life, and that is ourself. So long as you are satisfied that you have done all that can be done to make amends, then that's the best you can do.

I am very curious about this nameless one, but... Very Happy that's my issue. Thanks for your honesty, Az. As for Raph, I do find that interesting because in some accounts he is given credit for binding you to the earth. Can't remember now where I read that, but I do recall something of that nature.

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PostSubject: Re: Movie - Legion   Thu Apr 01, 2010 10:51 pm

He was one of the few who cried as they helped destroy us. He didn't agree with it, but he was 'bound' by his vows of obedience. Such as shame.

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PostSubject: Re: Movie - Legion   Sat Apr 10, 2010 11:40 am

Rereading you post Az, it has just occurred to me who the identity of this "nameless one" you refer to might be. If I am right, then I understand your reluctance to say it in open forum. It would definitely be a maelstrom of controversy. (Again no idea if I am right or not... just a gut feeling.) However, if by some miracle I have guessed correctly, then that would be a very serious accusation.

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PostSubject: Re: Movie - Legion   Mon Apr 12, 2010 6:48 am

Okay, never mind. It was the cold medication after all, and I am way off base. Rolling Eyes Az confirmed it wasn't who I thought, which I am very relieved to hear. So the mystery is still a mystery... one that I'll probably laminate on for awhile now because I'm just obsessive like that!

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